Tying Up to a pylon?

aero3113aero3113 Long Island, NYPosts: 150Member ✭✭✭
edited July 2013 in General Boating Questions
There are a bunch of pylons that we can tie up to at one of the spots we go to. If one is available, I'd rather tie up to a pylon than drop anchor. The problem I have is when we do tie up to a pylon it seems like the boat likes to sway back and forth with the wind.When I look at the other boats tied up it looks like they are sitting still in the direction of the wind. What am I doing wrong?
Post edited by aero3113 on

Comments

  • drewactualdrewactual Posts: 815Member ✭✭✭✭
    Current is almost like moving at idle... Almost.. lower the outdrive and trim tabs accordingly.... Works for me, anyway.. well, less the tabs.. I don't have those.. :-)
  • TonyWalkerTonyWalker Palmetto, FLPosts: 235Member ✭✭✭

    On the hook, I have seen our boat swing as much as 60 degrees each direction.  A big Sea Ray was doing the same thing on one instance.  So I was satisfied that this was the physics of the thing.  I can not imagine that it would be any different on a pylon unless you had a stern anchor deployed.  Just my 2c.

     

    Tony

    Salt Shaker 342

  • raybo3raybo3 Revere MAPosts: 637Moderator ✭✭✭✭
    Is this fresh or salt water. In salt water you have to allow for the tide. 
  • aero3113aero3113 Long Island, NYPosts: 150Member ✭✭✭
    It is in salt water. The boat will go in the direction of the tide when tied up but the boat will sway.
  • raybo3raybo3 Revere MAPosts: 637Moderator ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2013
    Are you also tying the bow on each side back to the dock cleats?
    Post edited by raybo3 on
  • aero3113aero3113 Long Island, NYPosts: 150Member ✭✭✭
    No, I have to tie it to the center of the bow rail. If I use a cleat, the rope will hit my anchor when the boat sways. But I never tried to tie to one cleat then go around the pylon and back to the other cleat.
  • raybo3raybo3 Revere MAPosts: 637Moderator ✭✭✭✭
    No not around the pylon. I assume your sterning against a dock in the back??? If so take the foward cleat on the port side and tie off to the back dock and do the same on the SB side. 
  • aero3113aero3113 Long Island, NYPosts: 150Member ✭✭✭
  • Black_DiamondBlack_Diamond Holland, MichiganPosts: 1,320Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    So mooring out. Any wind will move you, I swear mine seems to move more than others, but I bet they think the same of theirs too.
  • aero3113aero3113 Long Island, NYPosts: 150Member ✭✭✭
    I'm used to a mooring being a floating ball that is anchored to the sea bed that you connect to. What I'm talking about is a stationary wooden pole sticking up out of the water.
  • raybo3raybo3 Revere MAPosts: 637Moderator ✭✭✭✭
    OHH sorry thought you were sterning against a dock and tying the bow to a pylon. In that case its just like dropping anchor. Wind and current will make you sway. Dont worry about it and have a blast....
  • BoatAwayBoatAway DCPosts: 139Member ✭✭✭
    So mooring out. Any wind will move you, I swear mine seems to move more than others, but I bet they think the same of theirs too.
    it's the equivalent of "the grass is always greener on the other side"...
  • gslprogslpro Lake Winnipesaukee, NHPosts: 121Member ✭✭✭
    I have taken note of other boats while at anchor.  I have concluded that our height in the Rinker cruisers is what causes most of our extra sway.  Most other boats seem to be quite a bit shorter for their length than we are.  I of course, love the added headroom in the cabin, so I won't complain.  I saw a pontoon boat with only a bow anchor barely move at all, while I was cruising back and forth a good 60+ degrees without my stern anchor out.  Even with my stern anchor deployed, I will drag it a bit during sway.  I think it is just a tall boat, and bimini surface makes it even worse.  
    Gary and Diane
    290 FV Nauti Bonnie
  • TikiHut2TikiHut2 Sarasota, FlPosts: 926Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2013

    Aero, there's no pilings for us to tie to down here and usually it'd only be a channel marker sticking up which is absolute taboo to tie to and the USCG will remind you too. A mooring ball is typical if anything so you swing with the fleet and never set a stern anchor or risk upsetting the natural drift of the whole field.

    As to excess swing at anchor, GSL is absolutely right about the excessive freeboard of our roomy cabins causing our sway at anchor. We owned a sailboat that had a mile of freeboard and it would hunt all night long but our very tall 270 is even worse. It's enough that the anchor is tested in consistent oscillations every few seconds(chaffing with every cycle) but this can be a real problem overnight or in a storm if the wind shifts even further and your ground tackle doesn't reset absolutely 100% consistently (the 1st thing that came off of our 270 was that wimpy plow day anchor).

    Cruisers who deal with this will use a few techniques to stabilize this, most often by using a bridle, or even rigging a stay sail at the stern like a classic lobstah boat from NE that acts like the feathers of an arrow. Really.

    If you're going there, you might just go all the way and add a 6' keel and a mast amidship :) . Just kidding...rig a bridle on the bow to your anchor line about 8' from the roller tied to your P/S bow cleats. It'll solve 20-30% of that hunting at anchor and nearly eliminate any risk of chaffe. After you do it a few times it'll be 2nd nature. Happy overnight anchoring. Mike


    Post edited by TikiHut2 on
    2004 FV270, 300hp 5.7 350mag MPI Merc 305hrs, 2:20 Bravo3 OD w.22p props, 12v Lenco tabs, Kohler 5kw genset, A/C, etc.etc...
    Regular weekender, Trailer stored indoors, M/V TikiHut, Sarasota, Fl
  • BoatAwayBoatAway DCPosts: 139Member ✭✭✭
    TikiHut2 said:

    rig a bridle on the bow to your anchor line about 8' from the roller tied to your P/S bow cleats. It'll solve 20-30% of that hunting at anchor and nearly eliminate any risk of chaffe. After you do it a few times it'll be 2nd nature. Happy overnight anchoring. Mike



    i'm still waiting for someone to post a picture of what this means....
  • TikiHut2TikiHut2 Sarasota, FlPosts: 926Member ✭✭✭✭
    It was discussed on another thread and I think DI posted a pic. In DC for work so Im on the cell phone with no pics for a few days. Cya Mike.
    2004 FV270, 300hp 5.7 350mag MPI Merc 305hrs, 2:20 Bravo3 OD w.22p props, 12v Lenco tabs, Kohler 5kw genset, A/C, etc.etc...
    Regular weekender, Trailer stored indoors, M/V TikiHut, Sarasota, Fl
  • Dream_InnDream_Inn Annapolis, MDPosts: 667Member, Moderator ✭✭✭✭

    Well, I didn't post a picture, but gave quite a bit of detail.  Use the Prusik knot (google it) on the rhode in the middle of a 25 ft line, then tie each end to each of the forward cleats.  Let the rhode out until its loose from the windlass.  That's it!  You can even do this with a regular line (instead of your anchor line) that is tied to the piling (notice I didn't say pylon ;)  )

    Dream 'Inn III -- 2008 400 Express

  • BoatAwayBoatAway DCPosts: 139Member ✭✭✭

    i remember your write up, which was detailed as you said. but my brain couldn't process everything even after googling. i'm a dummy... :(

    Tiki Mike, how long are you in town for? Weather is supposed to clear up tomorrow if you want to meet up for a few....

  • TikiHut2TikiHut2 Sarasota, FlPosts: 926Member ✭✭✭✭
    Sent u a pm. Lets see
    2004 FV270, 300hp 5.7 350mag MPI Merc 305hrs, 2:20 Bravo3 OD w.22p props, 12v Lenco tabs, Kohler 5kw genset, A/C, etc.etc...
    Regular weekender, Trailer stored indoors, M/V TikiHut, Sarasota, Fl
  • drewactualdrewactual Posts: 815Member ✭✭✭✭
    don't know if you guys will care to consider this or not, but it may be of interest:

    I was an HRST master (helo rope suspension technique) in the Corps (a lifetime ago), and we were always working with different anchor systems... it's pretty easy on a bird, you just tie an anchor knot and clip it on the point, but when climbing, rescuing, or rappelling, it's a little different..

    below is a two point self equalizing anchor system.. you can use a three point, too.. it's really easy to rig- you just have a line tied with a line to line knot forming a loop- hang the loop over the anchor points (in this case a cleat), and then adjoin the line from between the cleats to the line exterior of the cleats to form sub-loops, if you would..

    the image below shows a water knot fixing the line, in step five- which can, in our cases, be abandoned.. that would allow full 'float' of the self equalizing activity..



    image
  • Dream_InnDream_Inn Annapolis, MDPosts: 667Member, Moderator ✭✭✭✭
    Drew, that defintely would not work with a rhode casue I can't see feeding the anchor thru that hole first.  As far as with another line, well, to me it looks like it could slip when there is slack in the line.  To me it looks like something that would benefit as a tow line.

    Dream 'Inn III -- 2008 400 Express

  • drewactualdrewactual Posts: 815Member ✭✭✭✭
    it's beyond doubt an anchor system.. (the word 'anchor' is used in a different context, and in a context more akin to a tow point, so you're right)..

    it would require two lines at a minimum- one for the system and the other 'clipped' to it to set to the pylon.. My notion was to pass through the closed loop bottom of the cleat on either side of the bow, with the attachment loop at least ten or so feet in front of the bow, so as to allow free movement, and so that it won't 'slip' off..

    this would basically take the anchor/rhode out of the equation, an use a line to the pylon, instead..

    anyway...

    do the pylons have attachment points in your area or are they just poles?  I've seen both, here- which is curious- because if you want a ticket from the popo, tie off on a stick and see how quick that happens! :-) .... I was down in the Keys last season, and they were about aplenty.. I reckon it comes down to region, how those things are intended to be used, huh?  Here, it is a supposed sign of distress for a disabled rig.
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